FoG II vs FoG (U)

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FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Blackbirdx61 » Sat Jun 24, 2017 5:09 pm

As some of use have a pretty substantial investment in expansions like immortal Fire. Two questions.

1. Will I be able to load Immortal Fire scenerios into the new app?

2. As Unity is painfully and obviously incomplete; took me about a week to figure that out guys. Do you plan to continue development of FoG Unity?

Suggestion as a new player who found this out the hard way, I suggest you just make 1.8 the default down load; vs having people download a half assed product you all have not up dated in a year and now seems to be headed for the bit bucket.

Tom

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by TheGrayMouser » Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:46 am

The long and the short is Newrosoft is still possibly working on the unity version of the game, but he ( one man show) is no longer funded by Slitherine... So basically what ever will come out of it is what the develop choses to do on his own free time.
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 84&t=73719

FOG 2 is a completely different game and engine, so no DLC's for FOG1 will be compatible.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Blackbirdx61 » Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:04 am

Thanks Mouse. Enjoy the rest of ur Weekend.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Vargas78 » Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:33 pm

I hope the Unity version can continue to be supported as i bought the FOG collection around christmas time (though i owned the base game from earlier on). Had i known that it was unlikely to be updated I'd have probably avoided it to be honest and gone for pike and shot + sengoku back then. Now i still hope Dan can pull of some magic but realistically, without slitherine's support anymore in the development of the update, and being tied to other projects makes such hopes very unrealistic. Furthermore with FOG 2 round the corner it's increasingly likely that FOG1 will be sidelined as a low priority.

A nice gesture by slitherine would be if those of us that back the expansion packs maybe had them cross over into FOG 2 or at least qualify for a discount. As i bought the product in good faith, knowing that there were issues with the unity version but thought it would be resolved and go on to be a better product than it was pre unity, giving it a new leash of life but this didn't turn out to be the case. Perhaps the biggest grievance is with the Viking based expansion as that one is only on the unity version, and not available in the original form of the game.

Sorry if i sound a bit negative as maybe everything will turn out ok on the unity version after all, but throwing FOG1 owners a bone with regards to the second game, should the first one not get fixed, would be a great way to reward customer loyalty and would even help FOG 2 have a solid player base to support it after it's launch. Though i'm sure it's going to be a successful title regardless, an active online multiplayer community in FOG2 would be a draw to newcomers.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by pipfromslitherine » Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:39 pm

They are developed by different teams, so development on one will not affect support on the other.

Cheers

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Micha63 » Sat Jul 01, 2017 9:45 am

Vargas78 wrote:I hope the Unity version can continue to be supported as i bought the FOG collection around christmas time (though i owned the base game from earlier on). Had i known that it was unlikely to be updated I'd have probably avoided it to be honest and gone for pike and shot + sengoku back then. Now i still hope Dan can pull of some magic but realistically, without slitherine's support anymore in the development of the update, and being tied to other projects makes such hopes very unrealistic. Furthermore with FOG 2 round the corner it's increasingly likely that FOG1 will be sidelined as a low priority.

A nice gesture by slitherine would be if those of us that back the expansion packs maybe had them cross over into FOG 2 or at least qualify for a discount. As i bought the product in good faith, knowing that there were issues with the unity version but thought it would be resolved and go on to be a better product than it was pre unity, giving it a new leash of life but this didn't turn out to be the case. Perhaps the biggest grievance is with the Viking based expansion as that one is only on the unity version, and not available in the original form of the game.

Sorry if i sound a bit negative as maybe everything will turn out ok on the unity version after all, but throwing FOG1 owners a bone with regards to the second game, should the first one not get fixed, would be a great way to reward customer loyalty and would even help FOG 2 have a solid player base to support it after it's launch. Though i'm sure it's going to be a successful title regardless, an active online multiplayer community in FOG2 would be a draw to newcomers.
Hello Vargas,

i think the problem is smaller as it looks like. From my personall point of view a fog unity was not necassary at all, i was always happy with the original FOG.
The original FOG covers a large timeperiod from egypts untill 1500 with great graphics, lots of scenarios which comes with the game and around 1000 usermade scenarios. For me this is absoulut fantastic and i"m greatful to all people who worked for this game. Also fog unity is a good game even it is not perfect. I"m happy cathyso is still working for the game. I"m sure this game will always have its fanclub. Fog 2 will not be an alternative for all players. I dont like 3d games and a stratgame without hexfields is on the long run a funkiller for me, but thats only my personally oppinion. So all people who likes to keep fog 1 alive should support cathyso in every way which possible , testing for exemple.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by fogman » Mon Jul 03, 2017 2:46 am

Micha is right. FoG (U) wasn't needed at all. People just wanted the remaining expansions. Slitherine made a huge mistake there: it kind of killed the large community of players we had and we still don't have FoG (U) 5 years later! FoG II is a completely different game, more based on Pike&Shot than FoG. I'm not a fan of Pike&Shot so FoG II will not necessarily supersede FoG for me.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by IainMcNeil » Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:39 am

Just a reminder of what happened. HexWar pulled out and left us with a game and no developer. We had to find someone to take the project forwards. Newrosoft contacted us asking to do it and said it would take 3 months to port to Unity.

The budget grew exponentially as did the time line.

If we had any idea how long it would take or cost we clearly would not have done it. Hindsight is great but at the time this was supposed to be a quick job to allow us to continue support the game. Looking back it would have been better just to leave things as they were but we always try to find ways to support the games if we can.

We've lost an awful lot of time and money on FoG U.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by vicco » Mon Jul 03, 2017 10:14 am

I hope Slitherine would consider giving a discount to FoG & FoG U owners for FoG II. This will hopefully draw the many fans of those games to FoG II. This will also give a large base for future expansions of FoG II.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Micha63 » Mon Jul 03, 2017 10:36 am

IainMcNeil wrote:Just a reminder of what happened. HexWar pulled out and left us with a game and no developer. We had to find someone to take the project forwards. Newrosoft contacted us asking to do it and said it would take 3 months to port to Unity.

The budget grew exponentially as did the time line.

If we had any idea how long it would take or cost we clearly would not have done it. Hindsight is great but at the time this was supposed to be a quick job to allow us to continue support the game. Looking back it would have been better just to leave things as they were but we always try to find ways to support the games if we can.

We've lost an awful lot of time and money on FoG U.
Really a sad story for such a great game. But i think the only future support the old Fog needs is to keep it compatible to new Windowsversions.
If Slitherine will do this would be great.

Just an idea. How about to declare the old fog to Freeware, only the maingame, not the expansions.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by MikeMarchant » Mon Jul 03, 2017 12:03 pm

Micha wrote:
IainMcNeil wrote:Just a reminder of what happened. HexWar pulled out and left us with a game and no developer. We had to find someone to take the project forwards. Newrosoft contacted us asking to do it and said it would take 3 months to port to Unity.

The budget grew exponentially as did the time line.

If we had any idea how long it would take or cost we clearly would not have done it. Hindsight is great but at the time this was supposed to be a quick job to allow us to continue support the game. Looking back it would have been better just to leave things as they were but we always try to find ways to support the games if we can.

We've lost an awful lot of time and money on FoG U.
Really a sad story for such a great game. But i think the only future support the old Fog needs is to keep it compatible to new Windowsversions.
If Slitherine will do this would be great.

Just an idea. How about to declare the old fog to Freeware, only the maingame, not the expansions.
Or make it OpenSource, I bet there will be people in the community who'd enjoy working on it.


Best Wishes

Mike

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Old_Warrior » Mon Jul 03, 2017 5:51 pm

I got a lot of play out of FOG but feel a tad disappointed in that I would continue to play FOG if the combat routine were changed. I am finishing up a series of games on this my return to FOG play and here are some of the things that could be fixed in FOG to make it a better game and for me I dont see it as very hard to do for a competent programmer:

1. FRESH unit attacks - matchup is similar ... the attacking unit takes 17 losses (out of 300 men) and DISORDERS. This is nonsense especially when its a KNIGHT unit that is very expensive in the points list. I am not saying the Knights should be totally invincible so read on ...

2. BEAT UP units at 50% losses taking 40 - 50 man losses and not changing integrity status (Disordered to Fragemented, etc). Again, here is where you see the opposite of the spectrum. You have been pounding the daylights out of a unit with say 3 units of equal type and when this happens you want to toss the monitor, PC, keyboard and mouse out the window. And never buy a Slith product again ROFL

Honestly ... if those TWO things were fixed I would continue playing this game forever. I really like the first edition of FOG. The UNITY version obviously needs to be improved but for me ... FOG works as long as those TWO things are fixed.

I hear the same from a lot of the guys I played. One guy noted my awful dice rolls and realized he got off lucky.

My other pet peeve is this one: the board is not large enough. Cav bow armies defeated Euro armies if the battlefield was OPEN. On the other hand if the battlefield was DENSE with terrain then it was the other way around. Thus the cav bow armies get trapped against a board edge ... all too often. I love the bow armies but the series seems to favor the combined arms armies the most or mainly infantry. The price to pay for the bow vs. the impact they have on the losses doesnt seem to be a benefit. Yes, I prefer bow over javelins but even with two ranks of bow units firing one after the other and hitting for maximum losses the enemy doesnt seemed slowed at all.

Just my two cents .... I like the game series except for those things. I can live without towns, forts, etc... these "pickup" DAG battles are a lot of fun.

Hoping to get in on the FOG2 beta testing. Tally ho!

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by voskarp » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:02 am

vicco wrote:I hope Slitherine would consider giving a discount to FoG & FoG U owners for FoG II. This will hopefully draw the many fans of those games to FoG II. This will also give a large base for future expansions of FoG II.
I would rather like they'd do a Mac version (Pike and Shot too).

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Old_Warrior » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:38 pm

voskarp wrote:
vicco wrote:I hope Slitherine would consider giving a discount to FoG & FoG U owners for FoG II. This will hopefully draw the many fans of those games to FoG II. This will also give a large base for future expansions of FoG II.
I would rather like they'd do a Mac version (Pike and Shot too).
Does the Unity version work on Mac?

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by voskarp » Wed Jul 05, 2017 3:18 pm

Not really... I'd say.

At least the latest version I could find for Mac.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Old_Warrior » Wed Jul 05, 2017 3:32 pm

IainMcNeil wrote:Just a reminder of what happened. HexWar pulled out and left us with a game and no developer. We had to find someone to take the project forwards. Newrosoft contacted us asking to do it and said it would take 3 months to port to Unity.

The budget grew exponentially as did the time line.

If we had any idea how long it would take or cost we clearly would not have done it. Hindsight is great but at the time this was supposed to be a quick job to allow us to continue support the game. Looking back it would have been better just to leave things as they were but we always try to find ways to support the games if we can.

We've lost an awful lot of time and money on FoG U.
That's a shame, Iain :( Sorry that it turned out that way. Hope you guys recoup the loss with other great titles! <thumbsup>

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by ctimmerman » Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:54 pm

What about those of us who bought Wolves from the Sea and Oath of Fealty thinking we could play them on an improved version of FOG? Now it looks like these add-ons are nearly useless unless they can be made compatible with the old FOG.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Old_Warrior » Sat Jul 08, 2017 7:38 pm

I am always up for a game using the Unity version of FoG.... not sure what keeps people from playing it. Looks like you can do DAG games server with the Unity version.

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by Micha63 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:46 pm

ctimmerman wrote:What about those of us who bought Wolves from the Sea and Oath of Fealty thinking we could play them on an improved version of FOG? Now it looks like these add-ons are nearly useless unless they can be made compatible with the old FOG.
I have playd both in the fog unity and had a lot of fun, where is the problem ?

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Re: FoG II vs FoG (U)

Post by phlewis » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:37 pm

When I bought Fog (U) the PBM portion didn't work. You could start a game but then it would lock up. Also many of the buttons didn't work. As far as I know the production version hasn't been fixed. If you want an improved version the only way is to get the current beta test version. I have been waiting well over a year at this point.

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