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Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 8:55 pm
by lhughes
Being a fan of Panzer Corps (Panzer General), why might I want to play Frontline instead? They appear pretty similar in spirit at first glance. I am indifferent to platform, so please speak to differences in gameplay. Thank you.

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 12:21 pm
by IonutG
Hi lhughes

There are a lot of game play differences between the two games.
Different type of combat mechanics(we use a lot of ranged combat, units can engage from different distances, we use ballistics to predict the outcome ...the closer 2 or more units are, the more damage the deal but also receive).
Different supply system, units have abilities witch unlock when units are promoted(level up)
Combat modifiers: flanking, surrounding, combat fatigue, suppression, etc.

Frontline is a more fast paced type of game.


Cheers,

Ionut

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 2:09 am
by Rosseau
I am pleasantly surprised so far. First, one can't ignore the cost differential. PC is really a system, with editor, cheats, unlimited replayability. FRM is on rails but I found its tactical challenges to be more difficult than PC so far. I've always found PC's AI to be rather bland. Not saying FRM's is better, but the designers have certainly built in a challenge. However, not to the extent that it's a puzzle game.

The opening screen resolution is a bit frightening, but even at 1280, once in the game, it doesn't detract. You can see all the little details like odds modifiers, low ammo, skills, etc. just fine. Although PC has more stuff to buy with your prestige, FRM's units have a bit more nuance to them based on type, experience, skills acquired, etc.

With 30 missions scripted out, my only concern would be a bug that would prevent continuation of the campaign. I have not heard of any, and they would surely be fixed, but maybe check threads from players who have gone farther than my measly 3 battles. Anyway, I would certainly recommend it. Not as simple as it looks.

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 8:46 am
by mboog12
Hi Rosseau,

That's well put. Some of the things you listed are very similar to the ideas we had in mind when we first started Frontline and we were deciding on how to position the game (in comparison to PC and other wargames). Even though PC is a complex game, we felt there is still room for other styles on ww2/panzergeneral wargames.
Frontline RtM is our first attempt at creating such a different style. We are happy with what came out as a first product, but there's room for improvement (tweaking mechanics & improving replayability), which we are doing right now. It makes us happy when players notice and appreciate the changes.

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 1:35 pm
by lhughes
Thanks everyone.

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 3:56 am
by gunhojr
rosseau where is editor and cheats i couldnt find any info on how to edit things your talking about pc version correct.

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:29 pm
by Rosseau
Sorry, I was referring to Panzer Corp's editor and cheats. Would love to have that for FRM maybe in a dlc.

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:43 pm
by Zhivago
There really is no comparison between Frontline and Panzer General/Panzer Corps. Ultimately, Frontline is a soul-less, half-baked, buggy Panzer Corps wannabe. I am not saying the game is totally unplayable, or non-enjoyable, but it leaves a lot to be desired. I have played Frontline extensively on iPad, and I played Panzer General when it came out in the nineties, and I've played Panzer Corps since it came out, and participated in its beta testing. There are so many bugs in Frontline that I have been tempted to get out a notepad to list them all. The most annoying bug is in the Kursk scenario, where the AI cannot recognize that all victory objectives have been met (occupying all cities), thus making it impossible to get anything but a "fair" victory.

However, my gripes with Frontline are much deeper. Unlike Panzer Corps where a player can build and upgrade the units which become part of your army and fight through the scenarios, in Frontline you are stuck with the developer's choices of about ten units that can be purchased in each scenario. Instead of a player having the freedom to choose any unit type that would have been chronologically available on the date of a certain scenario, you must work within the constraints of what units the game developers believe should be available to you. Ultimately, each scenario is played with a completely new batch of units that essentially remain faceless and anonymous. The units are all disposable pawns...there is no sense of loss when a unit is destroyed, as there is in Panzer Corps when a unit that has been part of your army since 1939 (and gained experience, and unique capabilities) is destroyed.

I won't even bother with the historical inaccuracies, or the mismatched power of certain units over others. However, there are a few examples worthy of mention. For example, a 500 prestige-point Goliath remote control mine unit can completely destroy any Russian unit of any type or strength. Or, a 200 prestige anti-tank unit is far more deadly to Russian armor than any German tank. You can build six of these throw-away units and have them occupy the six hexes around any Russian unit without firing a shot, and the Russian unit surrenders. Some scenarios can be won in a couple of turns using mainly paratroopers and and sorties from German fighter planes.

After spending the money for the app and additional scenarios, I am ultimately left with the feeling that this was a game rushed to market to trade on the Slitherine name and reputation (forged in large part due to the smashing success of Panzer Corps) to get suckers like me who have been fans and past customers of Slitherine games to buy it.

And by the way, where the heck is Soviet Corps, or whatever it is going to be called?

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 3:08 pm
by lhughes
Thanks for taking time to make an heartfelt and thoughtful reply. That was helpful.

Re: Versus Panzer Corps

Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 9:33 pm
by Zhivago
lhughes wrote:Thanks for taking time to make an heartfelt and thoughtful reply. That was helpful.
I'm glad you thought so. I bought the game, and I'm constantly being asked to rate the app, so I thought I would do so here.