Burma Road campaign issues

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Oleksandr
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by Oleksandr » Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:16 am

Ichthyic wrote:This is a fun little campaign, but has several minor bugs and missing items.

Several units have bad or missing values, wrong dates of entry, etc. The Gloster Meteor is missing, and actually even though you can take advanced aeronautics as a specialization, there is NO associated plane! Obviously, the meteor was supposed to be the plane you would get if you took that specialization... but it is missing in the data file.

The Churchill tanks you can get with Hobart's Funnies are unmodified heavy tanks. they SHOULD be: AVRE - standard fire, plus mortar launcher option that does much more shock and assault damage, and minesweeping. Crocodile - Heavy long range flamethrowing tank. Plus, the dates of acquisition are wrong, and you actually can't even get them in the campaign, even if you take the special, unless you change the dates.

Mission 8 appears to have a problem with the AI not attacking units during its turn. especially noticeable in the latter half of the map. It's just not at all aggressive, which is a total shift from the previous maps.

again, all these are minor issues, but I noticed them, so others probably did as well.
I would like to raise issue with units again - Crocodile and AVRE stats should definitely be changed. Maybe Crocodile could get some shock, and AVRE = standard fire plus mortar launcher as well as minesweeping, as Ichthyic proposed?

Also, I wonder why gloster meteor wasn't added after all...

GabeKnight
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by GabeKnight » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:57 pm

Burma Road scenario 11 (Imphal '44) reprise

Well, I'm still not very convinced about the early victory condition if both secondary towns are taken. Played at level 5 this time, but still didn't see a change in the overall progress or outcome. As always with level 5 difficulty, it just takes a bit longer to complete :roll: . My RP balance was about zero, meaning, I started with about 800RP and ended with the same amount. And I didn't play this scenario for some time, so in retrospect I should've chosen a little different force compositon, as no AA, no tac. bombers and very little own infantry was indeed needed. More tanks would've been wiser to complete this scenario even faster, I think.
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Around turn 7-8 the enemy's main assault was effectively broken, mop up duty and the siege of the two secondary towns was all there was left to do after that. I'm sorry, but I'm changing this scenario to not conclude before killing most of the Japanese (both assault waves!) invaders. I don't think that an early win is a real "reward" in this scenario. :wink: :D
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If a bold attack-while-you-should-be-defending approach is a valid strategy, then a player that is determined to fight against all odds and then even succeeds will not be satisfied by this. I mean, think about it, he'll want more... and... oh my god, there even is a huge army just waiting to be the next opponent that he can slaughter to satisfy the sweet feeling of complete victory, power and control over a seemingly stronger opponent. The *reward* for a fast and succesful advance should NOT be a premature end of the scenario but more enemies to be dealt with....in my opinion. It's fun dominating and destroying the enemy! :twisted: :wink: :lol:
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jakemon
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by jakemon » Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:43 pm

Ichthyic wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:10 am
Horst wrote:I hope the Brits will get more love in the upcoming North African campaign that also benefits the Burma campaign.

What’s also strange that thinly armoured Japanese light tanks require 5 supply but all somewhat better armoured and armed British Crusader and Valentine tanks require only 4 supply. The Matilda I tank, that is basically similar like a Valentine infantry tank, already requires 6 supply then...

In general, the supply requirements, especially the ground vehicle units, of the game don’t seem very consistent. At least I can’t always make a rhyme of the used rule there. For example, it makes not much sense if thinly armoured German Marder and Nashorn tank destroyers requires the same 5 supply like a monstrously armoured Ferdinand/Elefant tank destroyer, while a Tiger tank requires 7. Makes no sense from a historical and game-balancing point.
it's all about the classification of tank. Tanks designated "heavy" always use at least 6 supply, medium tanks 5, and light tanks 4. ultra heavies like tigers take 7. there are only a couple of units like that in the game. classifications are pretty much based on their actual weights during the time period they were made, and mostly the weight is due to the amount of armor it had. so a matilda, while about the same weight as a more modern medium tank (or even lighter), was a very heavy tank in its day. [snip]
Version 6.1.9 and units.csv circa 5/30/2018 appear to have bumped the Crusader & Valentines up to 5 CPs, removing one of my favorite early campaign advantages...
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GabeKnight
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by GabeKnight » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:15 am

While I was removing the "early victory" condition from this scen, I've noticed an exploit that could be considered an error/bug in the objectives design:

The "Victory2" trigger (=early victory trigger) only checks for the two secondary towns to be captured to award the win. This means, that even if the Japs would have overrun the whole map and captured all primary objectives, I'd win anytime before turn 30 by merely taking the two secondary supply depots (Moreh & Gambai). There's just one defeat trigger in the scen and it fires on "scenario end" only.

AMG
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by AMG » Tue Nov 20, 2018 12:11 pm

GabeKnight wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:15 am
While I was removing the "early victory" condition from this scen, I've noticed an exploit that could be considered an error/bug in the objectives design:

The "Victory2" trigger (=early victory trigger) only checks for the two secondary towns to be captured to award the win. This means, that even if the Japs would have overrun the whole map and captured all primary objectives, I'd win anytime before turn 30 by merely taking the two secondary supply depots (Moreh & Gambai). There's just one defeat trigger in the scen and it fires on "scenario end" only.
Thanks for this observation, I'll look into this.

13obo
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by 13obo » Tue Nov 20, 2018 12:44 pm

Is this you, God? Finally our prayers are heard.

AMG
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by AMG » Tue Nov 20, 2018 1:30 pm

13obo wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 12:44 pm
Is this you, God? Finally our prayers are heard.
I am not your god, but maybe your saviour? Only time will tell.

bru888
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by bru888 » Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:15 pm

Heh, amusing. Well, please take his comment as a sign of how much you are needed here, Adam. ;)
- Bru

GabeKnight
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by GabeKnight » Sat Nov 24, 2018 4:53 pm

GabeKnight wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:15 am
While I was removing the "early victory" condition from this scen [...}
For those interested: BurmaRoad Imphal '44 reworked :twisted:

Zachmann
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by Zachmann » Sun Mar 17, 2019 1:13 pm

Just finished "Burma Road" and wrote a positive review on "Steam".

Nevertheless I wasn't totally happy with the way "Operation Longcloth" was designed. Details are in the review, I'll paste below.

I'd appreciate some feedback very much, especially regarding "Longcloth"...if anybody felt similar about it, if the suggestion with the supply stashes could be something for future scenarios in your opinion, etc. - Thanks a lot!




" I found "Burma Road" to be a very interesting campaign - an do strongly recommend it to friends of this series!

To me it appears well balanced and somewhat more forgiving than campaigns like "Winter War" or "Panzerkrieg". You'll get your chance to build up a strong air element and you will be able to fight for air superiority in every scenario from "Z Force", the second one, on.
There are also enough ressources provided to assemble formations up to the CP limit while maintaining the experience levels.
And you'll be deployed in operations, that won't confront you with the most intense combat - so some recovery is possible during the campaign.

I liked the storyline of the campaign very much.
You'll start out with a small British force while Imperial Japan launches an overwhelming offensive in the region.
For years you'll fight in operational delaying actions against the Japanese, evacuating Commonwealth troops as effective as the situation allows, while losing Singapore, losing Rangoon, falling back towards the Indian border.
You'll be instrumental as the "Quit India" movement is supressed, which may be marking a moral low in a way, but serves to firm your force for early offensive attempts in 1943.
You'll experience some long range reconnaissance/infiltration operation with Orde Wingate and the Chindits in Central Burma, before you can establish a sufficient logistical base to launch a full conventional offensive to cross the Irrawaddy River and reconquer Rangoon.

I'd like to discuss two scenarios I had to restart once...also read in the forums that other players saw them controversely, too.

One ist the last one, where Rangoon is retaken.
Like other players I found that it affected the immersion. You're confronted with a superior mechanized force, including several prototype armored regiments. This force is defending RANGOON in the spring of 1945...and, used offensively, would suffice to force your corps out of Burma. That appears strange at this time in this setting.
Nevertheless this can safely be won. The key is to isolate RANGOON city from the surrounding region, use aerial reconnaissance to detect the mechanized troop concentrations that will be used for counterthrusts - and to to destroy all of them them piecemeal. Finally a pincer move via the eastern and western road bridges is possible to assault the city center. Then the Japanese supply situation and combat efficiency will be so dire, that you won't encounter much resistance.

Another scenario, "Operation Longcloth", appears more problematic.
In fact I won it by engaging a Japanese pursuing force in a rearguard action with half of the Chindit formations. The Japanese crossed a riverline, where it was possible to destroy them in a mainly static defense with infantry and AT support. That secured the own supply base which would've been overrun else - and would've put own forces out off supply, immobilized them, rendered them unready for combat, etc.

But I strongly felt that this must've been a strange approach to that kind of operation.
Would've expected that I was to evade the pursuing force, force march, do hit-and-run style actions, and so on.

Anyway, the Chindit scenario is a good and a very interesting idea! - That concept should be developed further for this series. I'd like it, if commando actions, long range penetration and raids were depicted in coming DLCs.
I do also think that the necessary mechanics are already available to solve this better than in "Longcloth".

Maybe extended unit supply stashes could be the key.
Perhaps they could be refilled when airdrop zones are reached.
That way supply stashes could provide units with a limited time window to perform combat actions and reach another LZ to resupply (all while being cut off from a regular source, simulating a situation in which airdrops are the only means).
That would force the player to carefully plan a time schedule, achieve his goals swiftly, limit combat to the necessary, move fast, evade pursuing forces.
I'd personally like something like that very much.


Overall "Burma Road" is a great design and a rewarding experience. "

kondi754
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Re: Burma Road campaign issues

Post by kondi754 » Sun Mar 17, 2019 3:13 pm

@Zachmann

1. Rangoon scn - I agree, that's why I plan to create a historical mod for the Burma Road DLC, where there will be no non-existing or prototype Japanese jets, heavy tanks and panzerjagers
Ok, I can say that I already started work on it (I prepared professional literature). Soon I will finish the Sandstorm historical mod and I will begin to modify Burma Road.
2. Chindits scn - I think that this is one of the scenarios, which I will not modify significantly, it's difficult and gives the impression of being ill-conceived but remember that the actions of Chindits and Orde Wingate ended in defeat in reality. This campaign was badly planned and even worse executed and was won by the Burmese jungle and the Japanese in fact. Maybe I'll make it even more difficult

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