Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

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StefanDK
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by StefanDK » Sun Aug 20, 2017 3:24 pm

I am sorry, but I "spilled the beans" on purpose - I do not think it is fair that some knows, and some does not. As said, I might be losing only because I did not know this about the scenario (we are on our last turn and nothing is decided just yet - it is "50/50").

Not to "complain", but I do not think it was alright not to inform about the "sudden death". Clearly my opponent knew - all of his operations in the last half of the game was based on the fact that sudden death would occur - anyway, it seemed that way, I can be wrong of course.

If we cannot talk openly about the scenario then I find that the tournament "owner" should list the scenarios that are to be played in advance so players can do their research. I could have done that, but I did not since I thought something like "sudden" death did not occur in a well balanced multiplayer scenario where it can not be expected that all players have played through all scenarios :-)

TonyAfan
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by TonyAfan » Sun Aug 20, 2017 5:56 pm

Hi Stefan you have my sympathy and you may still win. However I've been playing multiplayer only 6 months or so and found that quite a few of the multiplayer scenarios I have played have little quirks in them e.g. unexpected prestige points later in the game, unexpected weather, no replacement units etc. I had not played this scenario before so I had a look at the scenario in the editor and then also played the scenario as a hot seat game against myself to see if there were any surprises in the scenario, this does not take long, 10-20 minutes at the most. Even with this information I am not doing as well as I hoped and I think you have sunk any chance I had of victory :-). I would have thought that is what the more experienced players were doing if they were not familiar with the scenario .By doing this you can find out information that the scenario description does not tell you e.g. how many prestige points you are going to get at the start of each year in the case of this scenario, also when certain weapons become available etc, which will also affect the way you play the scenario. Anyway if you manage to get through to the next round have a quick look at the next scenario in the editor or in a hot seat game to avoid any unpleasant surprises.

StefanDK
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Posts: 85
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by StefanDK » Sun Aug 20, 2017 7:54 pm

Wow, that IS a way to get to know all about the scenario I guess. I have done that once in the past (1941 scenario, not an official one) because of the very complex logic. Else I have never thought of it as a way of getting info. I do not think that everyone in the tournament is (or should be) dissecting the scenarios like that, but that is up to each of the participants I think (and it cannot be avoided).

And you are right about the quirks - there is probably a lot. But the sudden death is one of the more drastic approaches to scenario building, I think.

Well, that discussion is somewhat irrelevant to the tournament - I will be posting the result of my matches against Kingshafter soon - he has just finished the final-final turn of the paired game so I am a bit eager to see how it turned out! Be in touch soon then ...

TonyAfan
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by TonyAfan » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:10 pm

Hi Stefan If as a newbie I thought of doing this I would be surprised if experienced players are not doing it. What is complex about it? If you haven't played the scenario before how are you going to have a realistic chance of competing with someone who has played the scenario multiple times. In a tournament situation you are not going to have time to play a test scenario against someone before you start your tournament game. I'm not suggesting you play the scenario in detail only that you quickly go through the scenario in hot seat mode to see what prestige points are awarded and when etc. and if there are any surprises like sudden death.

StefanDK
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by StefanDK » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:29 pm

The match, Kingshafter vs. StefanDK, has now finished.

We played a paired game and we each won one game. In both cases the Axis won.

I expect it had a lot to do with the somewhat better equipment of the Axis side compared to the Allies. Especially the performance of the American M26 really disappointed me - it had no chance against the Tiger II, Maus or Jagdtiger.

So who won, really? It depends on the rules, I guess so it is up to Goose_2. I will forward all information to him.

But the short story is that I ended up having conquered most small cities in total, but did lose more units than Kingshafter. So if winning the cities count for the most, I win. If destroying most units counts the most, I loose. If I were the judge (a bit biased here...), I'd say that cities count more than units.

The gory details:

After my last report where I had conquered the central cities, not much happened for 15 turns. We both upgraded our units in both our games and we made small advances and tried to sneak behind the lines, but without much luck. Also, my air force in both games were diminished, to say the least.

Suddenly, when the "sudden death" came into action in the last 5 turns, Kingshafter made a vicious advance on the central city in the game where he was Axis. He had all sorts of material - including a Maus and a heck of a lot of tactical bombers. On my end, I had a LOT of M26's, bought only one or two turns before (and I had disbanded a lot of units to get them...!), but I had not spend all the prestige (had about 4.000 left). And due to the sudden death I could not get any anti air which my armored vehicles really could have used to protect them from the Death from Above. Anyway, I held my position, but lost the central city once, then got it back, only to lose it in the final round where the Germans (Kingshafter in that game) had the final saying. He conquered half the central city (depot, really) so it was not so decisive. In the other parts of the map it was pretty quiet.

In the other game where I as the Germans held the central city the Allied forces had somehow upgraded their equipment to the best of the best (which was not surprising). But the surprising part for me was to watch some 14 strength units with an upgrade that I thought impossible. So I figure it might be so that you can upgrade to a whole different e.g. armor type and STILL be elite?? I was not aware of that and I have been playing for 6 years. Or maybe I was just not aware of the upgrade path. So suddenly I did not feel quite safe in the middle of the map. Kingshafter attacks ferociously once more, but this time a Tiger II tank, Maus and Tiger I stopped the advance. Another attempt was made to the south, but that was more easily stopped.

In both games I lost perhaps 20-30 per cent more units than Kingshafter.

And the final "city score" was:

Game 1 (me as Allied, Kingshafter as Axis):
Me: 4 victory hexes, 29 auxiliary cities with flags, lots of tanks, antitanks and planes lost (LOSS)
Kingshafter: 5 victory hexes, 26 auxiliary cities with flags, modest amount of units lost overall (WIN)

Game 2 (me as Axis, Kingshafter as Allied):
Me: 5 victory hexes, 32 auxiliary cities with flags, almost no infantry lost, lots of scouts lost, a little more air force lost than opponent, else almost the same as regards tanks, anti tanks and more (WIN)
Kingshafter: 4 victory hexes, 22 auxiliary cities with flags, lots of infantry lost, else almost the same (LOSS)

Total:
Me: 9 victory hexes, 61 aux. cities with flags (WIN?)
Kingshafter: 9 victory hexes, 48 aux. cities with flags (LOSS?)

I could also post the detailed casualties if anybody wants to see them.
Last edited by StefanDK on Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

StefanDK
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by StefanDK » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:31 pm

TonyAfan wrote:Hi Stefan If as a newbie I thought of doing this I would be surprised if experienced players are not doing it. What is complex about it? If you haven't played the scenario before how are you going to have a realistic chance of competing with someone who has played the scenario multiple times. In a tournament situation you are not going to have time to play a test scenario against someone before you start your tournament game. I'm not suggesting you play the scenario in detail only that you quickly go through the scenario in hot seat mode to see what prestige points are awarded and when etc. and if there are any surprises like sudden death.
Makes a lot of sense, really. You are probably the wisest of the two of us :-) Maybe I am just oldfashioned. If I am deemed the winner of the current round against my opponent, I will seriously consider practising the scenario, but I am still a bit wary thinking of preparing that way ...

goose_2
Tournament Organizer of the Year 2017
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by goose_2 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:04 pm

Now that was a battle.

Well fought and thoroughly enjoyable

As far as I can see based on all the information provided the winner of this match based on finishing prestige and the amount of primary and secondary victory hexes is StefanDK

That was an incredivble match up, but in my overall assessment.

StefanDK outplayed Kingshafter in that match up.

Winner StefanDK

Thanks for giving me all this great information and great way of seeing how everyone did.  I will pass it on to Hurly to upload unless one of you knows how to upload it onto the forum.

Thanks again for your participation Kingshafter and I look forward to seeing you on the Battlefield, and hopefully around for the next Tournament.

Blessings!
Dave
goose_2
Lutheran Multiplayer Tournament Organizer. :-)

StefanDK
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by StefanDK » Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:50 am

If prestige is the deciding factor then I stand to lose since Kingshafter had the most according to the replay and screenshots. I had something like 2,600 and Kingshafter had more than 6,000.

So a close fight, but I throw in the towel and bow to the rules of the tournament. Good game, Kingshafter!

kingshafter
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by kingshafter » Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:39 am

Hi Guys
MY AAR:
I was firstly hugely shocked by the choice of a ‘novelty’ map which I had never played, and due to a delayed start due to work commitments ending up at about a week or so, I was unable to do a solo run through. So I had no idea of reinforcement levels, times, etc. and didn’t really understand the notes provided nor as I found later – the importance of keeping the original equipment and troops.

But I ‘Kept calm and carried on’ and all went relatively well for the first few rounds. We ended up each holding one more Victory Position in alternate games.
I was convinced my opponent had intimate knowledge of the map as he seemed to foresee any attempts I made to drop Special Forces and yet his were like flies – popping up all over the place, yet I see from his reports that he was a Temporal virgin also. His recon skills are second to none.

Then came turn 10 (I think). Stefan brushed me out of the central city with ease – most of my troops surrendered and I was in the proverbial!
Contrary to his reports I really felt he was getting the dice roles – but we all think that in the heat of battle.

Having lost a good number of my hardened troops and equipment I was in dire straits and it was time for a drastic change of plan.
I would go for air superiority along with an extremely risky strategy of a precisely timed last dash assault of my Axis forces. This combined with a concerted attempt to conserve ‘Prestige’.

I realised that the Allies had no chance so hunkered down in defence and harassment - and tried to swat flies which continued to appear and grab prestige points regularly :) .
My Axis forces quietly attempted to get hardened for the furious last 3 moves or so.

So yes – Stefan had the most exciting and dominant game with his vastly superior troops while I was skirmishing where possible then running, hiding and biting my nails waiting for the end. I had serious doubts as to whether my daring plan would work.
Then we got Sudden Death FFS! and I thought I might just have a chance :)
Stefan seemed to have so much more kit than I so I realised he was spending Prestige like it was going out of fashion and hope rose.

So there you have it – Stefan is certainly a frightening opponent and extremely skilled at this game – and I would enjoy further battles with him as I think he has some skills I lack. I was lucky at the end certainly but ‘Fortune favours the bold’ said the Romans or ‘Who dares wins’ as our guys say.

Whatever is decided - Best to all

goose_2
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by goose_2 » Mon Aug 21, 2017 3:35 pm

Sorry this has taken so long to formerly make a ruling about this. I am literally wracking my brain over this one.

What is the deal with the Even rounds being the controversial ones? :? :x :oops:

Anyway, after much consideration I have to side with Kingshafter for this reason:
goose_2 wrote: Since there will be a chance for tie's to happen I will need you to save your last round screen shot so if both games with the same number of Major Objectives for both players than the player finishing with the most prestige wins.
I said this for the Round 3 match up, and I feel it only fair this be the case in subsequent Rounds. This is how the Tournament was set and only fair that it be ruled with impartiality. Watching the replay was seriously enjoyable and something to behold. I will pas sthem along to Hurly so he can post once the other 2 matches are finished.

So Kingshafter is winner of this match and StefanDK is not so fortunate.

Sorry for the confusion, I really hope this has not spoiled anyones enjoyment of this Tournament, Panzer Corps, or Multiplayer.

I am doing my best to make my judgments fair and impartial.

I look forward to the conclusion of Round 4 with wrap ups between:
DCK vs alexrus
tonyafan vs woken

Let us know, as 5 days left for completion within the time limit.
goose_2
Lutheran Multiplayer Tournament Organizer. :-)

StefanDK
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by StefanDK » Mon Aug 21, 2017 5:46 pm

Well I did realize that decision yesterday so it is okay.

I regret not being more offensive - I thought I would land in an ambush if I moved further towards the cities, but I should have done just that and I would - according to Kingshafter - surely have had the upper hand. Instead I became passive and more wary for each turn when Kingshafter did not make a move. I thought I might have missed something in the rules of the scenario and triple checked that I still had an advantage.

I still believe counting conquered cities is the best way to determine a win, also since the central city was only "half taken" by Kingshafter in the first game and "fully taken" by me in the other game. But as I said I do not object to the rules - I obey them with a "sad smile" on my face, knowing had I just acted a little different, I would be in the semi finals :-)

And thank you for the kind words, Kingshafter - I believe you managed to make the Allies their best with a 14 strength Comet or whatever it was.

All said and told, my wife will be happy to get some more attention - all these weeks with me discussing the tournament and the long run of the final battle has really not done much good :-)

I look forward to Panzer Corps 2 - and maybe the next tournament!

Good luck to the winners of this round and best of luck in the semi finals!

spacecece
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by spacecece » Tue Aug 22, 2017 7:12 am

I like these kinds of threads, and have been tempted to make some of my own
:D :D :D :D :D

ศัลยกรรม

woken
2017 Panzer Corps Multiplayer Championship 2nd Place
2017 Panzer Corps Multiplayer Championship 2nd Place
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by woken » Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:30 pm

Battle Report: TonyAfan (allies) vs woken (axis)

The sitzkreig is over. All preparations have been made and our offensive has
begun. Operating out of Delta depot, Kampfgruppe South moved north towards Gamma depot. Soon
contact was made with a strong allied line stretching from the Mu river to the
swamps in the east. Elite tigers immediately engaged the line and the battle
raged. Simultaneously Kampfgruppe Center assaulted the eastern side of Epsilon depot from
their base at Lambda depot. Kampfgruppe South was reinforced with elite elephants that
drove straight into the fray. Perhaps sensing that their line would shatter the
allies pulled back and reformed around Gamma depot giving us access to Epsilon depot. This was the goal of Kampfgruppe
South, now we could apply pressure to Epsilon from both sides at once. Eventually
Epsilon fell giving us five of the nine major objectives needed. The battle continues...
Attachments
turn18.JPG
turn18.JPG (125.14 KiB) Viewed 170710 times

goose_2
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by goose_2 » Wed Aug 23, 2017 1:39 am

Thanks, tonyafan, for letting me know about your surrender.

It was very gracious of you to recognize your oncoming demise, and bow out.  

Congratulations on making it into the quarterfinals.

I hope you have found the experience enjoyable and worthwhile, and most of all I hope to see you compete in the next Tournament.

woken,  CONGRATULATIONS!  

You are now in the Semi Finals!

This means only one match up remaining.

Alexrus and DCK, any updates on the progress of your match up?

I am so excited to set up the Semi Finals!!!  :D  :mrgreen:

Blessings,
goose_2
goose_2
Lutheran Multiplayer Tournament Organizer. :-)

spacecece
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by spacecece » Wed Aug 23, 2017 7:17 am

I like these kinds of threads, and have been tempted to make some of my own

คำสุภาษิต

TonyAfan
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by TonyAfan » Wed Aug 23, 2017 9:13 am

Congratulations to Woken he had me in a stranglehold once his elite Tigers drove up from the South to cut off the central depot. To all the successful players good luck in the next round and commiserations to the losers. Many thanks to Goose for organising the tournament.

woken
2017 Panzer Corps Multiplayer Championship 2nd Place
2017 Panzer Corps Multiplayer Championship 2nd Place
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:30 pm

Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by woken » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:31 am

Thank you Tony, it was a pleasure doing battle with you. You are a gentleman and worthy adversary.
Regards

Shards
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by Shards » Thu Aug 24, 2017 10:22 am

I've been away from this thread for a couple of weeks, and it looks like there's been some fantastic battles! Well played all!!

Good luck to the final four!

hurly
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Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by hurly » Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:34 am

here are the Replays for that discussed Battle between Stef and Kingshafter.

I had no time to watch it yet but goose strongly recommended to do so, so I think it may be really special and even the not so avid Replay Watcher might give it a try

woken
2017 Panzer Corps Multiplayer Championship 2nd Place
2017 Panzer Corps Multiplayer Championship 2nd Place
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:30 pm

Re: Panzer Corps 2017 Multiplayer Championship!

Post by woken » Sun Aug 27, 2017 1:42 am

Wonder what crazy map from dlc I don't have will goose2 pick for the next battle

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