Does simulating history matter in OOB?

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terminator
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by terminator » Thu May 09, 2019 7:23 am

krakoburger wrote:
Wed May 08, 2019 8:25 pm
I'm going to think about the problem of simulating morale in OOB. If I am simulating history within OOB, this is an issue.
I've thought about this because of a couple of books I read on the Winter War after I started playing, and a paper on fighting the Russians in Winter (https://usacac.army.mil/cac2/cgsc/carl/ ... s/chew.pdf) which had a chapter on the Suomussalmi- Raate Road Campaign that made me think that since I was playing the Finns, I had an advantage in morale, what they call "sisu." To simulate it in OOB all I could think to do was replay some of the battles with the AI's level dialed down and then back up as their morale improved. There is also the efficiency factor built in but I can't tell what the AI's condition is. Just wondering.
Morale is not simulated in OoB. The Morale factor is a very subjective.
It is simulated in some strategy games (John Tiller's Campaign Series) :

West-Front-Review-Head(1).jpg
West-Front-Review-Head(1).jpg (210.54 KiB) Viewed 536 times

Personally I prefer to have few combat factors but let these factors be clear that too many combat factors that make the combat prediction and outcome difficult to understand.

For OoB, we can possibly play on the aggressiveness of the AI to simulate the Morale (?)

PoorOldSpike
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by PoorOldSpike » Thu May 09, 2019 8:21 pm

We can regard a units fluctuating "Efficiency" factor as a "morale indicator" can't we?

Also, if we create a scenario, we can select units whose combat factors reflect the "global morale" of the period.
For example in this sample of vanilla 7.1.6 units we see that the stock German and Russian 1941 infantry units have exactly the same combat factors which is clearly unrealistic because the Germans have just conquered Poland and France, so the experience they gained there merits higher combat factors than the inexperienced Russkis.
Solution- use German Infantry 1942 units to get higher combat factors that reflect their sky-high morale, and change their name to Infantry 1941..:)

Image

Erik2
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by Erik2 » Fri May 10, 2019 7:19 am

To simulate the difference between German and Soviet troop quality in 1941 I did the following in several Barbarossa scenarios:
German unit experience = 2-4
Soviet unit experience = 0
Soviet infantry units = Conscripts (upgradable to regular infantry)
German commanders (most of the available ones minus Rommel etc)
The few Soviet commanders available were assigned on a much later turn

This worked very good in these scenarios.
I think it is best to use same-quality infantry as a general rule and add experience to high-quality units.
I view upgraded infantry units as generally having better weapons.
I may use earlier infantry models for special units like garrisons, security or other 'low-quality' units.

PoorOldSpike
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by PoorOldSpike » Fri May 10, 2019 2:09 pm

Erik2 wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 7:19 am
I think it is best to use same-quality infantry as a general rule and add experience to high-quality units.
I tried that but the problem is that Experience yo-yo's up and down during the scenario, so even if you assign a unit a high exp at the start, it could drop later if new non-elite replacements are pumped in.
And vice-versa if we start a unit with low exp, it's experience might have climbed to supermen level later in the game due to favourable combat results.

For the record here are some other vanilla 7.1.6 infantry units which I screenshotted today, but we should remember their factors might change with future game versions-
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PS- I've created several "Gallery" scenarios of the different nationalities like the one below, they're not actual games, they're just a line-up of units "on parade" so that I can click on them to get a display of their factors etc which is how I made the above screenshots-

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krakoburger
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by krakoburger » Fri May 10, 2019 6:27 pm

GabeKnight wrote:
Tue May 07, 2019 7:20 pm
krakoburger wrote:
Mon May 06, 2019 6:53 pm
Is it possible to modify the scenarios within a campaign ?
Don't forget you have to copy them scens from the game's base installation folder to the "...\My Games\Order of Battle - WW2\Scenarios" folder - and then back again. And make backups!
Where do I find these for a Macintosh install?
Thanks.

krakoburger
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by krakoburger » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:56 pm

Finally playing and early DLC, US Pacific, and I find a couple of disturbing points in game play that I can't justify against "reality." I am trying to figure out approx. time/turn in naval scenarios. A BB requires two turns to reload but my reading shows that reload times for main guns was about 30 sec. How does the game justify the slow turnaround?

PoorOldSpike
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by PoorOldSpike » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:43 am

OOB is a "FUN" game which is why I like it, so don't take it too seriously, I've tried plenty of "realistic" games but they bored the krap out of me..:)

conboy
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Re: Does simulating history matter in OOB?

Post by conboy » Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:13 pm

I must say that this was a thoroughly enjoyable discussion! It took me through a nice stogie and two IPAs.
I lean towards RTeam perspective and must say I thoroughly, respectfully, disagree with Kondi's statement that OoB is less suitable for regimental level play! I think it's quite suitable and realistic - primarily from movement,and artillery ranges.

That's the beauty of the game.

I do quite agree with Kondi on the big panzer reliability trait -- bring it back!

conboy

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