New AI artillery routines

[soldier]

I tried out Bagration a while ago as Germany but don't ever see the Russian field guns shoot. Instead i notice a few various German units are suppressed when the AI starts there turn. Same thing at Gustav line The Allied AI starts its turn but i don't see any guns firing just some suppressed German troops when the Ground forces attack. Is this working as designed ?
I also started Panther Wotan line in my DLC east campaign and although there's plenty of air activity to start off, there were a bunch of soviet field guns that didn't move or fire. Shouldn't they be starting the offensive with an artillery barrage now ?
I'am playing the latest patch

[sbdb]

It would be nice if one of the developers actually took the time reply, because I would like know too what is causing his issue.

[Kamerer]

I have not played the vanilla with 1.10, but in the DLC the AI is indeed doing it's thing - I played through '44 and am now in '45 with the 1.10 patch. The AI does the math of optimal arty attacks very fast and the artillery is really quick. Also, the AI is very, very poor at positioning and using arty so often there is just no shooting. In the DLC/GC, recall most Soviet infantry has a spotting range of 1 so while you might think you should be receiving artillery fire from units you can see, keep in mind they cannot see you. So they don't shoot.

I have found that in later '44 and '45 the SPA is much more potent, for example the SU-152s and others will take a much heavier toll than before. So the ai is indeed evaluating them as artillery and employing them better than before. Instead of just staying in TD mode they will switch and really hit when possible. Mostly I think this is because there is more regular, eng., and guard infantry which spots 2 instead of 1. So they can "see" to the full extent of their range instead of staying silent as before.

I wish the AI could utilize artillery more it; it would be much more realistic and much harder.

[robman]

My impression, from replaying some of the GC43 campaign in 1.10, is that the AI calculates both the effect of artillery AND the effects of a subsequent attack by other units on the enemy unit before firing or not firing. If it concludes that the subsequent attack is likely to be unsuccessful, the artillery doesn't fire in the first place. If this indeed is what it's doing, it's very clever.

[Kamerer]

My impression, from replaying some of the GC43 campaign in 1.10, is that the AI calculates both the effect of artillery AND the effects of a subsequent attack by other units on the enemy unit before firing or not firing. If it concludes that the subsequent attack is likely to be unsuccessful, the artillery doesn't fire in the first place. If this indeed is what it's doing, it's very clever.

Yes, that is my impression, too. Even when it "sees" a target, it appears that if it (ai arty) does not have adequate follow-on forces, it conserves ammo/doesn't reveal its position. Just as I would do. I agree, well scripted in that regard.

[dragos]

I don't think it's better for AI not to fire artillery unless it can further exploit it. Conserving ammo is a laughable excuse, no AI artillery unit ever encountered survived enough to run out of ammo. It should be always better to fire on any given occasion than never fire at all, even because of chipping away 1-2 points of strength damage. Remember the setting in the old PG/AG days, when the more "advanced" AI could become sometimes easier, because it retreated wounded units - still easy to pick up on the move, especially because they were in trucks - instead of letting them die on spot and forcing the player to advance more slowly. I hope it's not the case here

[airbornemongo101]

You also might not see the guns firing,because the efx files are screwed up. You will only see the "results"

Even the devs make mistakes. The are easy to make (usally a space or comma...etc) and when Mark Garnett makes his 1.10 compatible editor they will be easy spot and fix

[VPaulus]

You also might not see the guns firing,because the efx files are screwed up. You will only see the "results"

Yes, that could be a reason. As you know the efx is my "life".
And I've seen that efx quite well. There's only a typo, that I remember, so I would exclude that reason.

[soldier]

You also might not see the guns firing,because the efx files are screwed up. You will only see the "results"

I'm not sure if thats the problem. I didn't see the guns being shown or any action from them but saw everything else move. The German units appeared to be suppressed from the start.
I also tried to reload my Panther Wotan DLC battle with the old patch to see if the AI would move forward and fire but the saved games did not work and only displayed blank maps for some reason, so at the moment no info on either issue.

I also highly doubt the AI is "conserving ammo" for a follow up attack. I'd be surprised if its that advanced and as it was first turn of the battle there were plenty of attacking units around

[airbornemongo101]

When I start re-doing my mods to make them compatible w/ 1.10 I will check out the vanilla arty units.

If there are mistakes I will fix them and release a patch for them.

[airbornemongo101]

Yes, that could be a reason. As you know the efx is my "life".

You are the undisputed Master of the EFX......