Impact Phase Shooting

[Leganes]

Hi.
1. Imagine a swiss pike block approaching a unit of arquebusiers. The swiss can move further than the arquebusiers can shoot. In the rules it states that shooting during a charge is covered in the impact phase. The only shooting factor is the one linked to salvo. I cannot find any other mention.
2. A unit of light horse approaches spanish genitors who are armed with a javelin. It charges them. It can charge further than the javelin can be thrown. Is the javelin not an impact weapon? It does not factor in the impact calculations.
3. The chosen tactic of Austrian cuirassiers against turkish horse from the 16th-17hC was for them to halt the charge with firepower; hence the classification of pistol as firepower and melee and not impact. There seems no factor in the impact phase that takes into consideration this tactic.

Surely there is the possibility for firepower to affect a charging unit's forward momentum.

thanks

[kevinj]

1) The FoG combat system is very abstract and combines all of the activities, including short range shooting immediately prior to impact into the POA system. In your example, although it is possible for a Swiss Pike block to move so that it can charge but the Arquebusiers are out of range, the Arquebusiers will get their own turn before this can happen so can move into range and shoot the Swiss before they charge.

2) FoG combat is based on the way that troops used their weapons, rather than the weapons themselves, so troops with a short spear that is principally used as a throwing weapon will have the Javelin capability. If they use their spears principally as a combat weapon they will have the Light Lance capability, which gives them an impact benefit. If they used spears for both purposes they will have both capabilities (and pay the extra points)

3) Again it's down to usage. If the troops principally used their pistols immediately prior to combat they will have the Impact Pistol capability. If their principal use was distant shooting they will be able to shoot, but not gain an impact benefit. The weapons may be the same, but it's the usage that determines the POA.

[Leganes]

With respect to moving to shoot before impact; ranges of only three make this hard. Also, shooting in the turn BEFORE a charge doesn't act to hinder the momentum of a charging body in the impact phase. Understand the idea of abstraction, but there seems no negative factor as a consequence of receiving fire before impact.
Regards.

[ravenflight]

With respect to moving to shoot before impact; ranges of only three make this hard. Also, shooting in the turn BEFORE a charge doesn't act to hinder the momentum of a charging body in the impact phase. Understand the idea of abstraction, but there seems no negative factor as a consequence of receiving fire before impact.
Regards.

Well, it does if you cause and they fail a cohesion test... which isn't always easy, but in effect is what you're asking for. If the 'charging body' disrupted during the previous shooting phase several things can happen:

1 - They cannot recover from that shooting cohesion loss that turn, so must wait until the following turn (q.v.);
2 - They choose to stand and attempt to recover from cohesion loss. If they choose to stand the shooting has 'hindered the momentum of a charging body'.
3 - They can choose/attempt to charge. If they are non-shock troops they CANNOT charge without a test (which has been negatively affected by the cohesion loss). If they are non-shock troops that fail to test to charge then again, shooting has 'hindered the momentum of a charging body'. If they are shock troops or non-shock troops that passed a cohesion test to charge then they will charge at a disadvantage in numbers of dice (not always impact POA however)and the shooting has caused a 'negative factor as a consequence of receiving fire before impact'.

It may not seem to be the case because since the last shooting phase you've had quite a bit of stuff happening, but shooting most definitely affects the ebb and flow of the game's impact phase. Trust me, I used to run Louis XIV French, and part of the reason I gave them away was because I felt that the loss in shooting dice was not made up for by the + POA in the impact phase. Often I would be shot down before I got anywhere. I have also shot Swedish Brigades to the point when they impacted me they were not in good shape and resulted in a victory for my Ashigaru. That's 'average foot bowmen' shooting down and eventually routing 'superior salvo foot'.

Against Swiss and other keils/tercios... well, they are tough to beat, but once beaten you've taken care of a big chunk of their army, usually double the number of attrition points.